I’ve just now returned from Springfield (and I think you’ll all like what we have wrought there).
So… there seems to be an indictment or five, and I’m betting you all want to talk about it. I know I do.
But rather than slapping up a placeholder entry while I contemplate an afternoon nap (I awoke at 3 AM PDT in order to catch my plane), I’ll open the floor to your comments in the box below.
Have at it!
Fanny Roborat
62 comments
waterfowler
October 28, 2005 at 3:54 pm
1Adam,
From the end of the last thread, it seems they’re pretty sad. They still haven’t got the Monkey, the Architect, or Halliburton. From this side, no one person is that big of a deal as long as we get the SCOTUS.
Allison in Santa Cruz
October 28, 2005 at 4:09 pm
2But the Scotus is at least something, and there’s hope still that they might get the Architect later.
I caught the end of Fitzgerald’s press conference and have been listening to the NPR analysis. I really want all this turmoil to make the Bush administration to implode on itself.
Pleaseohpleaseohpleaseohplease…
waterfowler
October 28, 2005 at 4:37 pm
3Allison,
Sorry, I should be more specific. “They’re pretty sad” referred to you lefties. By “this side”, I meant us right wing-nuts. Scooter’s no big deal. Even if y’all got the Architect, Delay, even the Monkey, it doesn’t matter as long as we can get the SCOTUS. It’s all about the ROE.
Mary
October 28, 2005 at 4:53 pm
4I’m expecting a really nasty battle for the SCOTUS. The Dems are not about to let an extreme righty on the court and there are a number of Repubs that don’t want that either. Will the right roll over the extreme right? Good question and we’ll have to wait and see. But I expect a good deal of bloodshed.
As for “Scooter” and company, at least there was some sort of indictment. Perhaps others will eventually occur. Delay is still on the ropes and Halliburton is up for taking some hits as well- via Katrina, Rita and Wilma.
The hard core may be staying put but there is definitely dissension among the troupes.
waterfowler
October 28, 2005 at 5:00 pm
5The only rope Delay is on is the Dem. lynch mob’s in Travis Co. As soon as the case is out of Travis, Delay walks.
How old is Ruth Bader? Isn’t it time for her to retire as well?
Redshift
October 28, 2005 at 5:21 pm
6Heh. “The only rope on DeLay” — that’s a good one. This charge isn’t even the big one for DeLay — the Abramoff scandal is going to be the really serious one for him.
But just keep telling yourself that no matter how many Republicans pretend laws don’t apply to them, put party ahead of national security, and undermine our democracy for personal gain, that it couldn’t possibly be anything but a partisan witch hunt. I’m sure that’s very comforting, and when they go to jail, that victim mentality will help you cope.
Harold
October 28, 2005 at 5:42 pm
7I can’t help thinking that the big smile on DeLay’s face in his mug shot is from him contemplating how he shall avenge himself upon the latest additions to his long, long list of enemies.
Pete IVDL
October 28, 2005 at 6:27 pm
8Harold, DeLay would have to be related to Wowbagger the Infinitely Prolonged to get time to catch up with his list of enemies. (And yes, I know Wowbagger’s prolongation was a result of an accident - was it a banana and a piece of string? - so relatives would be unaffected).
I heard a right-wing “commentator” on one of our late shows here tell the world that the Clinton Witch-hunt was far more important than the current witch-hunt; not because a man was caught with his dick out of his dacks, but because he was The President Of The Yoo Ess Ay. Since the current “minor affair” only involved players totally unrelated to The President, it just wasn’t as important.
I’m sure there was a fine line there, apparently, although it seems to have been blurred by the repeated abuse by the Republican party since “George Bush” was “voted” “President”.
Redshift - nicely put! Perfectly put, in fact. Althought, to be honest, I don’t think it’s limited to just Republicans; but they have an uncanny knack of abusing power to within an inch of self-destruction, then whining repeatedly and moronically about the consequences!
It’s funny, isn’t it, the arrogance of stupidity - that look on DeLay’s face (it is his face, right?) is so reflective of his obvious thought processes : “You’ll pay for this. All of you. I know who you are. You’re all gonna pay for hurting Zoldo, Lord of Murkiness. Drat those pesky kids.” (Sorry, that last bit just slipped in…)
Bob
October 28, 2005 at 6:59 pm
9Hear that, Scoot? Your right-wing buddies think indicting you is no big deal. All across this great land of ours, your former allies are making you out to be a peon, a loose cannon, a nothing. Zillions of watts of foam-at-the-mouth radio is discounting you as a meaningless pimple on the butt of the ultra-conservative juggernaut.
At this point, I’d remind you that it’s extremely important to protect your friends. Provided, of course, that you can figure out who they are.
ice weasel
October 28, 2005 at 7:04 pm
10It’s good to see waterfouler back in here stinking the place up. I thought I smelled a digital fart.
Anyway, I’m still in wait and see mode. Scooter’s gone. If he has any sense, he’ll plead out, that is assuming Fitzgerald wants a plea.
As for the rest, there’s no way to tell. Fitzgerald is playing his card very close to his chest.
As for Delay, he’s toast. But, for the sake of 2006 and 2008, I hope the rethugs hold on to him for dear life. It will make things so much easier.
I guess the only other observation I would add, and it’s one that is sort of bittersweet as I was a registered republican for the first two decades of my voting years, is that not one single republican has come forward to say, “Hey, we really are better than this, we really are still conservative and you know what, one or two of us have some small shred of integrity.”
I don’t expect it to happen but it would at least be interesting. I’m not a huge fan of the comic book roles the rethugs have assumed in the last 20 years. It would be more fun for us, who have to play the home version of American Democracy, to at least be able to pretend there was some honesty left.
No biggie.
On an entirely irrelevant note, it’s possible to apply for and get a concealed weapons permit in my state for less than $20 and in no more than two business days. I know.
Pretty bizarre when you think about it.
madbard
October 28, 2005 at 8:05 pm
11“oFficial A” = Fanatical Apathy = Adam Felber (we know the Preznit’s is dyslexic.)
Admit it, Felber! You outed George Takei!
Steve
October 28, 2005 at 8:52 pm
12Why do I get the feeling that Miers was a feint and that they’re going to pull Robert Bork out of mothballs?
SeattleDan
October 28, 2005 at 9:01 pm
13Wait…was George Takei in the CIA? And Adam told Novak?
cooper
October 28, 2005 at 9:06 pm
14ice weasel, once a Republican, huh? Well welcome to the free thinkers fold; remember, there’s no fanatic like a convert!
My hope is that Scooter goes to trial and lays open the whole sordid affair about the lies, the schemes, the cover-ups, and the hubris that took us to war in Iraq, in order to get a lighter sentence. Of course, Cheney will probably have him ice picked in the shower before it gets that far. Nothing personal; just business.
waterfouler, shouldn’t you be cleaning gun barrels? Sprucing up decoys? Skinning puppies? Drowning kittens? Mixing Exlax in with the Halloween candy?
Harold
October 28, 2005 at 9:13 pm
15Ice Weasel, I wanted to give you props for calling Libby out back on July 12:
http://www.felbers.net/fa/2005/07/09/miller-time/#comment-9612
(Well, maybe this was common knowledge back then. I think it was the first time I heard Libby’s name come up.)
Waterfowler, you were part of that 61-comment pileup - were you being facetious when you suggested you hadnn’t heard Libby’s name up until a few weeks ago?
http://www.felbers.net/fa/2005/10/26/the-latest-from-felber-and-the-wo rld/#comment-11042
As for George Takei - well, ever since he pulled off his shirt and ran through the decks of the Enterprise barechested with a fencing foil (in the episode “The Naked Time”), some of us suspected, just a little.
And on an unrelated topic: Yesterday I hear Dubya defending the planned slash-and-burn of Operation Offset because, as everybody knows, we hafta help those people “down there in Katrina.” Yes, he did.
dee, blogwwhore
October 28, 2005 at 10:31 pm
16Harold — I, too, heard the “we’ve got to help those folks down there in Katrina.” But since he’s been in Margaritaville himself lately, I’m not surprised.
Scooter needs to get off those crutches pretty soon because Rove has run rings around him. Does anyone really believe this was all Scooter’s idea? Now that he’s seen how his administration friends have his back, he might decide to start singing.
Or he may decide to take one for the Emperor.
waterfowler
October 29, 2005 at 1:10 am
17Harold,
Um…..I don’t recall. I was baking cookies….
Cooper,
Guns are clean, decoys are ready. Other than that, I actually have a chihuahua that hasn’t been skinned yet, although I do let my little rednecks shoot stray cats w/ their BB guns because they perch under my bird feeders.
Frozen Rodent,
Thanks for the compliment. It’s no longer a requirement to have a permit to carry a concealed weapon in this state thanks to our nuts in the state house. Where is the gun crime worse, DC or TX?
cooper
October 29, 2005 at 8:56 am
18waterfouler,
Bird feeders hung low, no doubt, so the cats will be drawn to the feeders, hoping to get a bird and the “little rednecks” get to shoot the cats in mid air, as they leap for the birds. “Rube Goldberg KillSeeker” - Didn’t I see that set-up in “Deer Salter’s Digest” last month?
David
October 29, 2005 at 11:01 am
19This is from Juan Cole’s Informed Comment website. Wish to hell I’d thought of it, but a very deep bow to Juan.
posted by Juan @ 10/29/2005 06:27:00 AM
New Word: “To libby”
It seems to me that we may have the makings of a new lexical entry, what with the indictment and resignation of Irving Lewis “Scooter” Libby.
It strikes me that “Libby” is close to “fib.” So “to libby” would have the connotations of “to tell a falsehood.” But it is also close to “lobby.” So the sense would be of lying for the purpose of convincing a large number of persons to adopt some policy that was bad for them. Thus, “the pitchman libbied his audience to buy snake oil as a way to treat their gout.” Or, “the mole libbied the public on behalf of a foreign power.” That could be definition 1 in those numbered entries at Merriam Webster.
The name is also close to “libel.” So it would have an overtone of launching a vindictive smear. “To retaliate for the critical review of the film, the director had the newspaper libbied.” Again, the sense would be that a persuasive falsehood was told, but here with the connotation of ruining someone’s career and reputation. This could be definition 2.
I’m sure there are other dimensions of the verb “to libby” that haven’t yet occurred to me.
The Los Angeles Times argues that the ordeal may not be over for Vice President Richard Bruce Cheney. I agree. A trial of Libby could yet through up information that would spark further indictments. In fact, I take from Fitzgerald’s language on Friday that he actively envisages such a possibility. Cheney was one of four individuals who told Libby that Valerie Plame Wilson worked for the CIA. And, as Steve Gilliard cannily points out, Cheney told Libby specifically that Plame Wilson was in a division in the Directorate of Operations. That is, any knowledgeable government official would immediately conclude that she was not a mere analyst but an undercover field officer.
LindseyD
October 29, 2005 at 11:22 am
20Hey there. Sorry for the shameless advertising, but I just wanted to let all the silly geeks out there know that my site is holding a Fitz-O-Ween chat indictment party today, starting at 12pm central time. It’s a good way to take a break from the last few months of sifting through “Plame-gate” leaks and rumors, and maybe meet some new internet friends. Feel free to stop by.
Thanks
-LindseyD
ice weasel
October 29, 2005 at 12:37 pm
21Harold, thanks for the props. I’m not sure i deserve them. I went back and read that post and while I did mention scooter, I also castigated the press for not telling us more about what was happening. While in a larger sense that criticism still stands, the actual players, folks like Timmeh, really should not have said anything to “us” given what Fitzgerald said in yesterday’s press conference. While the witnesses were not under force of law to keep quiet, he did say he asked them to not talk about their testimony. So my bitching about timmy not coming clean is kind of stupid. My mistake, I’ll own up to it.
Cooper, nobody likes cleaning guns, it’s a just a necessary thing. Well, let me ammend that, nobody I know enjoys it. I’m sure there are some for whom the odor Hoppes or Rem Oil has pleasant memories. Not me. Maybe fouler is into drowning, hell, nothing surprises me anymore. At least I feel that way.
Fouler, I don’t live in DC so I have no idea what the gun violence rate is there. However, given the rather unique nature of that community, I can easily understand some restrictive statutes on firearms and frankly agree with them.
As for Texas, well, suddenly I’m feeling kind of guilty for giving you a bad time. Living in Texas is, as the Wise Doctor once told me, punishment enough for most things. I wonder who you fucked with in a former life?
I do think there is merit in licensing CC. Very few people fully appreciate things they get for free. Frankly, I’m a bit dismayed my state doesn’t at least require some compentency with firearms or familiarity with the laws. But, I have to say, I enjoyed the process and the low cost. Since my state enjoys CCL reciprocity with Texas, rest assued, if I am forced to sojourn through the lone star state again, I’ll be prepared.
-the armed liberal
Oh and fouler, weasel aren’t rodents, they’re an entirely different class (hmmm, class, family, genus? I’m not sure). Look for family Mustilade.
Just sayin’
Sharon
October 29, 2005 at 12:38 pm
22It’s already happening! My wildest dreams are coming true! The right-wing-nuts are already spinning that lying to a grand jury and to the FBI are merely “technicalities”. I LOVE IT!
Pete IVDL
October 29, 2005 at 5:45 pm
23Irving? IRVING??? No wonder he prefers “Scooter”.
Now that Dubya is enjoying his mid-school-term break (does this guy nap in the afternoons or what?), I’m sure “Scooter” will change to “Lewis” in the next few days, then finally “Irving” (snigger) before the fatal “We have complete support for Mr. Libby”.
What’s all this anti-shootin’ things? I grew up in the bush (the “country”, not the POTUS), and shooting was just a part of keeping the livestock alive. Kangaroos, rabbits, foxes, feral cats, the occasional trespasser… Fox-hunting was how dad & I spent most Saturday mornings. Now? Even dad (who still lives in the bush, although not on the original property) has had to hand in the shottie, since he needs to justify his requirements in a 23-page police permit request, which needs to be renewed every 12 months, plus a $210 licence fee, which he can’t afford as a pensioner. So his vegie patch is raped by rabbits, his fences and sheep are attacked by kangaroos and foxes (respectively; I’ve never seen a carnivorous kangaroo, although they used to roam the continent), and feral cats decimate the native birds attracted by his painstakingly designed native flora garden.
And now the brain-softened suburban “greenies” are whining about using traps, because they hurt the cutie-wutie fuzzy-wuzzy bunny wabbits!
Please believe me, there are legitimate uses for guns. Trouble is, there’s still too many illegitimate uses for them too. (I don’t know what my point is anymore, but while I totally disagree with Senseless Violence™, the current gun laws here in Oz make it almost impossible for those with legitimate needs for weapons to obtain and use them, while not limiting the spread of firearms through the cities for purely murderous purposes. You guys can do better than this.)
Roberta Williams
October 29, 2005 at 6:19 pm
24Adam,
I saw you in Springfield and really enjoyed the show. I am happy to see one indictment, but would love to see more.
Congrats on the highest percentage of winning.
dee
October 29, 2005 at 6:37 pm
25Now that Dubya is enjoying his mid-school-term break (does this guy nap in the afternoons or what?), I’m sure “Scooter” will change to “Lewis” in the next few days, then finally “Irving” (snigger) before the fatal “We have complete support for Mr. Libby”.
To be followed by “Liddy? Oh Libby! Well I can’t be expected to remember the name of every White House gofer. Now, watch this drive”
ice weasel
October 29, 2005 at 6:42 pm
26Pete, now I’m having trouble wrapping my mind around a few things. I’ve never been to your beautiful country, it’s one of my goals, so my knowledge is really limited. But, roos and foxes attacking sheep? Holy shit, those are some dangerous animals you have there. Or, I suppose, those are some really small and timid sheep. Wow.
Well Pete, things, in a sense, aren’t much different here in a gross sense. The maniacs have trouble finding firearms for both legal and illegal purposes. We really can’t (be caught) shooting at the “wildlife” unless properly licensed and then, only in certain locations.
And please, just for the general mental health of the thread, I’m not a hunter. The one time I went hunting, as a kid, all I shot was cabbages (no pheasant to shoot). I have no desire to shoot animals, I get too much pleasure from shooting inanimate objects, especially paper (and that offends, bummer).
Anway, so while we’re not beset with ferocious kangaroos and maniacal foxes, we have problems of our own.
To wit, in lovely south central PA, where I make my home, we have this problem with enormous (and I mean truly awe inspiring big) flocks of crows. These things actually darken the skies when they are in flight and, from what I understand, they can devastate fields. Anyway, the most recent “solution” the crow problem was, wait for it, over ten thousand dollars worth of poisoned Cheetos.
I noted the other day, at work, one of the huge flocks flying nearby. I guess crows aren’t all that fond of Cheetos.
That might explain why things have been quieter on Frat row lately though…
hedera
October 29, 2005 at 7:23 pm
27Pete, I understand your concern when your father can’t protect his veg patch from the rabbits; only the wildest-eyed of the animal rights nutz is worried about rabbits. Endangered they ain’t. Ditto deer - Walt Disney did the American wild areas the worst imaginable turn with Bambi. “Don’t shoot Bambi’s mother!” Deer are pests, sorry but they are. And I’m sure the gun restrictions are annoying but Lobster, I wish we had ‘em here.
I understand the hunters better than you think: my grandfather was a Missouri dirt farmer, among other things, and all the men in my family hunted, including my dad. Hunters I don’t worry about too much. But this insistence that guns should be freely available to every idiot that wants them has a price tag that I’m not sure we, as a society, can afford to pay. The NRA would have it that they need guns to defend against the gummint should it come after their civil liberties; let me tell you, I’m in much more immediate danger from the idiots in the inner city, all of whom have Saturday night specials, than I am from the gummint. The U.S. government isn’t that organized. These guys aren’t organized either, but by the living Lobster, are they ever armed.
We’ve lost an entire generation of inner city school kids, I’m talking pre-teens. They have no hope, because they know that at any time, an idiot with a gun can drive by and spray them and their friends with lead, and that’s it. Why try with that in prospect? Why study? Why anything?
Just recently, a 14 year old girl told her 17 year old boyfriend that she wanted to break up with him. His response was to show up the next morning as she walked to school with her friends, and put five rounds into her back with a pump shotgun. After which he got into his car and blew his own head off. Just because the pump “shottie” was available.
A little longer ago a brilliant, successful, caring young woman, who escaped the inner city to college and came back to do some good, was being hassled on the street one night by (I regret to say) football players from my alma mater, U.C. Berkeley. She called her dear friend, a man she called “brother”, to come and help her. He came armed, and - he shot her. Because he was a crummy shot. Because she moved. Who knows? The football players were untouched. She’s dead. He’s in jail. All because he had the gun.
We can’t afford this price. We’re killing our own children, because it’s the Right of every American to Bear Arms. How long, oh Lord?
cooper
October 29, 2005 at 7:46 pm
28Good one, dee.
Adam, another great show. When your book comes out, pull some strings and get on Diane Rhem or Fresh Air or both. That would be good fun.
Pete, sounds like Oz is still wrestling with the “Grey Plague” of rabbits. I remember seeing a picture in our 8th grade World History book of hundreds of dead rabbits strung up on a wire, the result of a day’s hunting on an Outback farm.
cooper
October 29, 2005 at 8:01 pm
29I just saw a great “Get Your War On” panel!! Go to this link and scroll down to the 10/08/05 entry - http://www.mnftiu.cc/mnftiu.cc/war50.html - in truth they’re all great. Warning, you may spend the next 2 hours at that site.
Allison in Santa Cruz
October 29, 2005 at 8:10 pm
30Despite my personal feelings about it, I do have to admit that hunting is a valid use for guns. It’s the drive-bys and utterly senseless killings that are so tragic. And, as hedera says, it’s the young people who are dying. Our future.
Family Mustelidae — includes skunks, weasels, stoats, and everybody’s favorite marine mammal, the sea otter. When I’m teaching marine bio to non-majors I call them “sea skunks,” trying to get them to see beyond the furry cuteness to the nasty nature of the beasts.
Allison in Santa Cruz
October 29, 2005 at 8:12 pm
31Forgot to add, that this week’s WWDTM was the best I’ve heard in a while. I was on my way home from the lab, laughing so hard that people in other cars were looking at me nervously. The part about the upper and lower breasts was hysterical! And I didn’t even get to see Paula’s visuals.
David
October 29, 2005 at 9:19 pm
32Thanks for the link, Cooper. I have one of the GYWO comics from a couple of years back, but hadn’t seen anything recent. I love it, hating of course the fact that such humor is required by this administration and its evil lawlessness.
David
October 29, 2005 at 10:26 pm
33Link to a hell of an article by Robert Fisk. So Pete IVDL, is Fisk right that Australians are about to be at risk of charges of sedition for objecting to Australia’s military presence in Afghanistan and Iraq?
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article10807.htm
ice weasel
October 29, 2005 at 11:55 pm
34And Adam, As soon as the rest of the show, I’ll add something more substantive. The twenty minutes I heard today was great.
shitbag jr.
October 30, 2005 at 5:14 pm
35Wow, you sure do BS a whole lot! This whole blogger thing is really sad! I am happy that you found a mate that enjoy’s grandiloquent recognition from web-dorks as much as you do! Keep up the good work!!!..and remember, you are special and unique! Just like everybody else!
-Chow
cooper
October 30, 2005 at 5:33 pm
36Adam, good to see that you’ve ventured out into the valley, rubbed shoulders with the great unwashed and are learning the lingo. The whole “Bob and Judy and Scooter and Valerie” blog was but a mere warm-up for your remarkable recounting of the “Campaign of the Carnal” out in CO. during this week’s WWDTM. Well written and presented wonderfully. I guess you have to be able to put your head into a place where you’ve decided, ok, you’re going to tell a humorous story, but it won’t be funny unless you nail the timing, the inflection and accent. And you’re going to do it in front of a live audience and on a nationally broadcast radio show. Adam, my boy, you have the talent. I thought that Paula was particularly on her game this show, as well.
Keep us smiling.
ice weasel
October 30, 2005 at 7:55 pm
37Hedera, I won’t make light of tragic stories you posted. They are genuine and I can’t “refute” them even though we disagree on the larger issue.
cooper
October 30, 2005 at 9:53 pm
38waterfouler,
I’m curious. Does George W. Bush seem like a normal Texan to you; or does he strike you as a rather sad product of generations of New England blueblood inbreeding amongst the Cabots, Lodges, Prescotts and Walthams, exiled from Bostonian High Society into the dusty god-forsaken wilderness of Crawford, TX?
Or is he just drinking again?
waterfowler
October 30, 2005 at 11:28 pm
39Cooper, It’s the latter. But, imagine what Joe Redneck has had to compare him with. Kerry…Clinton…Pelosi…Gore…the ACLU…, after looking, he’s the closest to a normal Texan of the lot.
Allison, Thanks for the clarification on Frozen Sea Skunks name.
Frozen Sea Skunk, It looks to me like you and Hedera don’t want “inner city” folk to have guns……? If you ever get to the Lone Star State, I’ll take you fishing and we won’t have to see what a bad shot you are.
Pete, You are now a certified NRA gun nut. You made the mistake of using common sense. Welcome to my world.
Hedera, Please quit puking on us. There are thousands of stories of people defending themselves against thugs by using guns, but those stories aren’t good “news” because the bad guys usually die. Do you really think the boyfriend only killed her because he had a gun? Or do you think he might have used a knife, or a baseball bat, or a tire iron, or his hands….let’s ban baseball!!!!!
hedera
October 31, 2005 at 1:21 am
40Waterfowler, I think if the boyfriend hadn’t had a gun, he might not have killed her at all.
I don’t have anything against the “inner city” folks; they’re the ones who are suffering the most from the epidemic of uncontrolled firearms.
And I agree that it’s not necessarily wrong to defend yourself with a firearm, but the presence of firearms greatly increases the risk of fatal accidents. If you don’t have a gun - and I don’t - you can’t accidentally kill someone with it.
Daino
October 31, 2005 at 7:30 am
41Duhhhh. He was nominated, er volunteered, to get indicted because his name is…Scooter.
Scooter? Need I say less.
Daino
Pete IVDL
October 31, 2005 at 8:27 am
42Hedera, that’s it in a nutshell. The people who deserve the right to own guns have to jump through beue… beaur… paper warfare of the worst kind, while we in Oz are seeing a sad and awful ramp-up to the gun-induced violence we see (or no longer see, since it’s so passé now) on the international news. It’s such a pity that the argument about the right to bear arms focuses on the right to shoot people, rather than the right to protect what’s ours by all reasonable (and sane!) means.
Ice Baby - you should see the ferocious Drop Bears. You think the koala is cute? Wait until you hear ‘em hunting in packs on All Hallows’ Eve… The foxes will attack even large, non-timid sheep if they can. They usually worry them by nipping at their exposed legs until the silly buggers bleed to death. Mind you, we also have major problems in most “proto-urban” parts of the country, where the unthinking cityslickers let their dogs out at night.
David, yes, if I say anything about Bonsai (our Prime Minister, he’s just a little Bush), I get seven years’ detention and they can shoot me anytime they think I’m trying to escape custody. The best part - wait for it - is if they do detain someone for speaking out against the War On Terror/Poverty/Dictators/Whatever, the detainee is not allowed to notify anyone of the fact, since that also falls under the category of sedition, and the other party would then have to be detained as well.
I figure I start my electrical apprenticeship in January, so in about 5 years’ time I can find a nice job in Antarctica. Assuming it hasn’t melted. (Note the smooth segué back to global warming? Neat, huh?)
I promise to restrict future posts to less than 1 thousand words….
Scooby
October 31, 2005 at 10:23 am
43Giving the right wingers a conservative SCOTUS is probably the best thing that can happen for us! The religious right have been riled into political action over abortion. So give them what they want, and they will no longer have their political motivation. I expect the majority of those who were mobilized these past few election cycles will withdraw into their comfy bubbles.
I think we have been too focused on Roe. So, let’s imagine Roe is reversed. The issue falls back to the states, and I think the majority of the states would uphold abortion rights, esp the most populated.
Comments?
dee
October 31, 2005 at 12:07 pm
44I think we have been too focused on Roe. So, let’s imagine Roe is reversed. The issue falls back to the states, and I think the majority of the states would uphold abortion rights, esp the most populated.
Because I am friggin’ tired of fighting this fight.
Because I don’t want access to competent medical care to be more geography/money dependent than it already is. Because the right to choose included the right to have a baby. Because no matter how they try to disguise it, limiting a woman’s access to safe abortions is punishing her for having sex. Because there is no guarantee that the radical right will relent, even in the “most populated” states, and not push for a ban while those who are pro-choice sit back and let it happen.
Because I am friggin’ tired of fighting this fight.
Mr. McBeevy
October 31, 2005 at 12:50 pm
45Off topic but in keeping with the season, anybody care to guess who the rest of the Eight Cheneyed Orangutans will be? So far we have Frist, DeLay and Libby. We have a shot at Rove. Just a little Halloween fun to guess who will swing from the chandelier chain next.
ice weasel
October 31, 2005 at 2:04 pm
46fouler, anytime you want to shoot for money (or liquor) I’ll be happy to do it. Shooting is something I’ve done nearly every week of my life since I was old enough to point and squeeze. Fishing is something I’m terrible at, so you win that one default. If I need an excuse to drink, it won’t take a boat and lot of expensive equipment with barbed ends to get me going.
It cracks me up you see someone like bush as appealing to “normal texans”. It’s no surprise to me, but it’s funny. Perhaps the best example I’ve seen in a while of “personal definition”.
Finally, your ignant remark about “inner city” only demonstrates your proclivities, not mine. By the way asshat, I live in the “inner city” and strangely enough, most of my neighbors do own firearms. Wow, I bet you’re really scared of that, eh? That fishing pole won’t be much protection when the scary “inner city” folks come to attack, or rape your wimmin, or whatever it is we’re supposed to do.
Pete, Drop Bears? Now you’re teasing me with snipe stories.
Scooby
October 31, 2005 at 2:05 pm
47I hear you, dee. The quality of life (healthcare, education, opportunities) is completely geo-economic. I’m working for the day when that isn’t the case.
But we are where we are… and I think we need to choose our fights carefully.
I obviously don’t know for certain about a religious right withdrawal from politics, but it sure seems that they have been mobilized by only a few hot topics.
The Dems took 40 years to squander their dominance in DC. I’m encouraged that the Repubs are nearly out of political capital after only 10 years.
Sharon
October 31, 2005 at 2:23 pm
48If the so-called religious right gets its way, and Roe is reversed, then the rr will no lobger have a carrot to dangle in front of its so-called moral values base. That’s why I think it’s not going to happen.
Is it just me? Am I so cynical that I’m the only one who thinks that Harriet Miers was just a “throw-away” nominee? And that this Scalita fellow was the real choice all along? Shrub has always said that the two jurists he most admires are Scalia & Thomas. (It takes one to know one.)
dee
October 31, 2005 at 2:49 pm
49If the so-called religious right gets its way, and Roe is reversed, then the rr will no lobger have a carrot to dangle in front of its so-called moral values base. That’s why I think it’s not going to happen.
Gay marriage
Sex education
School prayer
Intelligent Design
They have plenty of carrots. They will always have plenty of carrots because none of it is really based in religion (any more than Osama is fighting for Islam. It is about political power, and whatever will get them political power is what cling to. If they thought they could energize their base by citing Biblical references to polygamy to make it the law of the land, they would.
Jim
October 31, 2005 at 2:49 pm
50Pete;
Koala bears hunting in packs!!?? Hunting what…eucalyptus leaves?
As for the foxes and rabbits, I’m assuming neither creature is indigenous to Australia. Unlike the roos and the drop bears (snork).
Also loved the title you give your pm.
dee
October 31, 2005 at 2:50 pm
51Boy — I type ugly when I’m angry.
ice weasel
October 31, 2005 at 4:04 pm
52Can I use that excuse Dee because I cannot think of single when I have ever “typed purty”.
Maybe it’s a because I’m a big hairy male.
Murray
October 31, 2005 at 8:56 pm
53Hey guys it’s easy enough to ridicule nonsense and point out the internal inconsistencies of foolish arguments with out having to resort to personal attacks.
WF. I always wonder about those who love waterfowl so much that they spend lots of time and money to increase their numbers in order to be able to kill more of them. Seems to me that if you love ducks, you love ducks, and that wouldn’t include turning them inside out with a 12 gauge.
BTW How do you stand on the competence issue? Do you think W has done a good job of getting Osama? Running the Iraq war? Raising the income of Americans? Helping disaster victims? Fixing Social Security? Bringing morality back to the White House? Securing our liberties?
You may think that getting the SCOTUS to overturn Roe would be your biggest victory but the Republicans would be sent back into the wilderness faster and farther then they have ever been. When MOST of America, who want the decision of birth, adoption and abortion to be between themselves and their doctor and or minister and not dictated by a bunch of Republican men realize that that right has been taken away they will rise up and vote in numbers that even Diebolt and Republican vote counters can’t fix.
Murray
October 31, 2005 at 9:01 pm
54Say WF, How about the Assault Rifle Ban? Are you the kind of hunter that needs MORE than one of the following to bag your deer? Grenade Launcher, tripod mount, bayonet, magazine that holds more than 10 shots? Do you think that there are any weapons that should be off limits, or should we be able to protect our property with land mines, bazookas and M16s?
Just wondering?
waterfowler
November 1, 2005 at 7:42 am
55Sea Skunk,
We need to hang out down on the bay. We can drink, shoot, or fish. It sounds like you could use a little time to chill.
Murray,
The 12 gauge is for when you might want to eat one. The main reason to duck hunt is to be there in the woods, marsh, rice field, or wherever to watch the world wake up. Duck hunters are really wildlife watchers. They rarely shoot a limit (6), and often go home empty handed. The real magic is the falling stars, the big dipper, a full moon, deer, alligators, snakes, ‘coons, and occasionally convincing a wild bird to come see you.
Murray
November 1, 2005 at 7:51 am
56WF. I get all of that with my camera, and no wild life has to suffer for my being there. (I was a naturalist in a state park for a number of years).
waterfowler
November 1, 2005 at 3:17 pm
57Murray,
Do you eat meat? Wildlife doesn’t suffer as long as I’m careful w/ my shot. But, I do agree, a camera is the best thing to shoot wildlife with, but you can’t grill the pictures.
Pete IVDL
November 1, 2005 at 4:23 pm
58Jim: Yep, the Agricultural Terrorists here are all illegal immigrants. Cats, foxes, and rabbits.
And now we’re facing an even stranger, and far more serious) problem: cane toads. Seems the toads (imported to “take care” of pests in the canefields) have spread all over northern Australia and into Kakadu national park, where their poisoned sacs are killing goannas, numbats, and any other kind of native carnivores/omnivores. Now, if we could just get the foxes to eat the cane toads…
Ice: The sight of a dozen furry, guttural-coughing koalas fanning out in the underbrush to surround old or weak humans foolish enough to go out at night is, while ecologically satisfying, just a campfire story. At least, no-one’s ever seen ‘em doing it. Unlike cooper’s jays, which sound like they’re related to pterosaurs.
Landis
November 1, 2005 at 4:39 pm
59At least, no-one’s ever seen ‘em doing it and lived to tell the tale.
Waterfowler, I have to agree that some of the most ardent defenders of the environment that I’ve met have been hunters. I don’t own a gun, I can’t hunt (hell, I escort spiders out of the house), but I do eat meat. I don’t like the idea of trophy hunting at all, but if you eat all that you take I’m OK with that. In the mean time, I’m going to hang out in Murray’s camp and just take pictures.
Thanks for sticking around and if not providing prospective, at least keeping us all thinking.
Murray
November 1, 2005 at 5:02 pm
60WF.
I’m not against hunting per se. I allow hunting deer on my property because of the serious damage they do to the undergrowth, woodland flowers and my fruit trees. Turkey and ESPECIALLY Grouse are protected
I don’t eat beef because it is so damaging to the environment. It takes 10 pounds of feed protein to make one pound of beef, and cattle are seriously destructive to fields and streams.
I do eat chicken and turkey and I prefer to have them free range but I’m not fanatical on that point.
I do wear leather belts and shoes.
I am willing to accept the farming of cattle, pigs, sheep, turkeys and chicken for their meat and products. I just find it mentally incongruous that if someone loves an animal he shows it by killing it.
David
November 2, 2005 at 2:23 am
61Used to hunt, used to be a member of the NRA (way the hell back, before it became a lunatic fringe organization with nary a clue about sane firearms regulation for the benefit of both gunowners and non-gunowners).
Quit gun-hunting because I could no longer tolerate the explosion of a gunshot shattering the silence of a sunrise in the scrub.
Fish, but I refuse to fish for anything I won’t subsequently eat. Once killed a 6-foot rattler because it was headed for an elderly neighbor’s yard. Ate it because rattlesnake is quite edible, and it made it a little easier to accept having to kill it. Really pissed off a friend when I refused to stop so he could kill a rattler out in the scrub.
Ain’t no consensus out there about how humans should relate to other living things, and probably never will be, although mostly we seem hell bent on driving them to extinction, the cruelest kind of killing.
Alaska Joes Fishing Trips
January 26, 2006 at 1:53 pm
62Enjoyed Fabulous site!